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February 22, 2002
"Phill Wilson of the African American AIDS Policy and Training Institute"
An interview with Phill Wilson, Executive Director of the African American AIDS Policy and Training Institute and a 2001 Leadership for a Changing World Awardee. Read Background. Leadership for a Changing World
Thank you for joining us today for Leadership Talks. Our guest is Phill Wilson, Executive Director of the African American AIDS Policy & Training Institute. Phill is also a 2001 Leadership for a Changing World award recipient.
Phill, can you tell us what brought you to social justice work?
Phill Wilson
When I was seven or eight I discovered that some of my friends received weekly allowances. No one gave me anything for cleaning my room, doing well in school or washing the dishes after dinner. When I brought this injustice to my parent’s attention, they smiled, sat me down and explained that we were a family. “In families,” they said, “everyone has a role to play. That’s how families survive—Everyone doing their part.”
There are a lot of things that motivate me to do the work I do. The most powerful are all very personal. I do feel a need to do my part. I am a black man living with AIDS. If not me, who?
I am also raising two teenage boys. They fuel my passion for social justice. They remind me of the dangers of complacency. Every morning when I send them off to school and every evening as I watch them say grace at the dinner table or struggle to finish their algebra or history homework, I worry about what the future holds for them. I have a responsibility to teach them by example to do their part and to help them develop the self-confidence to know that they can make a difference.
Finally, I have seen a lot of injustice in my life. I see it every day. I also see what happens when people are treated fairly, when they are loved and supported. If an individual can blossom with support, so can a society.
Miami, FL
Are you well connected to leaders like yourself, and do you talk
about what constitutes leadership, and the challenges of it? (One of
the cliches about leadership is that it's lonely at the top. Is it?)
Phill Wilson
I don't know if it's lonely at the top. I think it's important for leaders to develop support networks. And like any other networks, it's important when they are doing similar type of work and activities.
I try to have networks of other people who are leaders and who are doing social type work such as this. I certainly try to do that. Most importantly, it is an opportunity to learn from them, too.
Chicago, IL
Can you give us some examples of how you work with other communities such as artists, sports figures, business leaders, educators, and religious leaders?
Phill Wilson
The first thing about our philosophy about working around other communities, particularly artists, is to work with people where they are. We work with people with what they bring to the table and what they want to offer. Examples of our working with artists is working with Danny Glover and Motumbo, the basketball player, in Durban, South Africa. They helped us work around the stigma of AIDS in South Africa.
We didn't demand or put pressure on either of them to become AIDS experts. We allowed them to talk about HIV and AIDS in the context of their lives.
The second example would be a project we're working on with another Leadership for a Changing World awardee, the Cornerstone Theater. And we're working with actors, playwrights and directors, and black clergy on a project called Black AIDS, Black Faith.
Washington, DC
What have been the hardest questions you have faced in working with ministers on HIV/AIDS?
What can be done to address the negative stereotypes associated with HIV/AIDS in the African American community? It seems as if this is a topic, along with others such as homosexuality, that is avoided in certain segments of the African American community, especially in the church for instance.
Phill Wilson
I think the biggest challenge is AIDS forces black ministers to deal with a lot of subjects they are uncomfortable dealing with. It raises the question about homosexuality but it also raises issues around sexuality.
It raises questions around drugs and prisons, things that are happening with young people.
I think the question of stigma is manifested in black communities, again, because AIDS is a stigmatized disease that deals with death and people want to distance themselves from death. And it deals with sex and drugs and all of those issues.
I think it is really important to humanize the disease so that when we talk about AIDS we try not to talk about all of the numbers and all of those things that allow people to distance themselves from the disease but we talk about the people in our lives.
And when you do that, when you talk with the black clergy, when you talk about who they counsel, or the way they create sanctuary for or the people they heal, then it is an easier discussion.
New Haven, CT
How has going public with your own HIV/AIDS diagnosis positively and negatively affected your work?
Phill Wilson
Going public with my HIV status has helped my work tremendously. It was never a question of whether to do it or not. So much of what we do is about truth and openness and honesty and courage. So it is not possible for me to ask people to confront something that they think is frightening if I am hiding a very important part of who I am.
So much of fighting AIDS has to do with understanding love. And if you hide things from them, they can't love you.
The biggest advantage in disclosing my HIV status is that it got rid of so many barriers. It means that I didn't have to use so much energy hiding things. It means when I talk to people they can't hide behind things that are distractions. They have to look me in the eye and ask, how am I going to deal with this issue and how am I going to deal with this person?
Gary, Indiana
What are some of the ways the AAAPTI can be a resource for local programs?
Phill Wilson
AAAPTI can help local programs in a number of ways. The most important thing we do is we provide a way for local programs to connect with information, through our Web site and through our newsletter.
People can see what other African American organizations are doing to confront HIV and AIDS.
The second thing is we can help organizations with townhall meetings and to bring resources to do AIDS updates in black communities.
Our biggest programming involves training African Americans in the science of AIDS.
One of the biggest barriers in the black community is that there are a lot of myths about AIDS science. And when people understand the science of AIDS, they are better equipped to protect themselves from the virus, they are better able to adhere to regimens if they are in care, and they are better positioned to affect AIDS public policy.
Washington, DC
Can you elaborate more on the Black AIDS, Black Faith collaboration with Cornerstone Theater Co.?
Phill Wilson
The Black AIDS, Black Faith program is one of the most exciting programs we're working on today. It's exciting because it is symbolic of the way we do our work. It's a collaboration with different communities. In this case, it's a collaboration with the Black Faith community, it's a collaboration with Cornerstone Theater in Los Angeles. It's a collaboration with people who are affected by AIDS.
We believe that AIDS work and social change work happens over time and it is at its best when the work allows communities to get to know each other.
In the Black AIDS, Black Faith program, we are beginning a year-long dialogue about the role of the Black Church in the fight against AIDS, which will culminiate with a theater piece that will potentially travel around the country.
Boston, MA
How has 9/11 changed the way you lead? Has it affected the way you present your ideas? How has it affected the AIDS issue?
Phill Wilson
I don't think 9/11 has changed the way I lead. If anything, it has brought clarity. In some ways, AIDS is a metaphor for what happens when people are disenfranchised. It is what happens when you mix poverty and lack of information and lack of access to health care, and stigma and isolation. You mix that up and you have the ferment for an AIDS epidemic.
One thing that 9/11 did, for Americans at least, it made us aware of how vulnerable we can be. And what 9/11 has done for me is reinvigorate my efforts around social justice and around making sure we all are clear about how vulnerable we are and how connected we are to each other.
One of the challlenges of 9/11 for those of us who do AIDS work is the general response to 9/11 has been very narrow. It has been around the specifics of the World Trade Tower mostly. As a result, it is difficult for people to focus on other social issues.
I am concerned that that narrowness of focus will increase the number of casualities of 9/11. In addition to all the families that were destroyed in September, we will lose sight of other issues that are vitally important and there will be even greater losses.
San Diego, CA
As leaders, who are your heroes? Have your hero-leaders changed over time? Do you have new ones whose style is substantially different from the heroes you had as a child?
Phill Wilson
My heroes have not changed. My core heroes have always been my parents. They are two people who never give up. They believe that if you are honest and you are compassionate and you work hard and you have love in your life, you can be happy. And that is an inspiration.
Raising a poor family, my parents understood that they could not give their children a lot of material things, but they could love them. They could give them confidence. And they could say to them, "You are okay just as you are." I think about that every day when I interact with other people.
I don't know what role a person can play in the work that is important to me, but I do know I can treat that person honestly, humanely and decently. That is my responsibility.
What they do from there is basically on them.
So as far as heroes, I think there are a lot of heroes out there who the core of what they believe is the whole notion of treating people decently and fairly.
Nashville, TN
Do you feel that your leadership style is different from what we traditionally think of as leadership? If so, how?
Phill Wilson
I'm not sure if I know what traditional leadership is. I don't think that my leadership style is different from people who I perceive to be effective leaders.
I think that leadership is, first and foremost, about sharing and caring about people and trying to find ways to help people fulfill or maximize their potential. That is certainly what I try to do.
The other part of effective leadership is tied to learning and/or following. I never know if an idea that I have will work or if it's necessarily the right thing to do. So I'm required to check in with other people. And in that process, I learn.
I think that you have to be willing to learn, you have to be willing to talk and to listen. That is critical.
A critical part of my leadership style is to do three things. The first is to try to be clear about my ideas and my commitment. The second is to try to be honest about the limitations of those ideas and commitments.
A third important thing is to be responsible and to hold yourself accountable. When I put something out there, good, bad or indifferent, I'm responsible for this, and I am willing to take the heat if I'm wrong.
New York, NY
What have been your key leadership challenges and how have you responded?
Phill Wilson
Knowing my limitations, being able to say that yes, this issue is really, really important, but no, I don't have the wherewithal to address this right now. I have a tendency to want to respond to all of the social issues that are on the table at any given time. And it is important, as a leader, to be able to focus, to be able to say that I can only handle one or two or three things well at a time. And to be okay with that and to really understand that it is a contribution when you recognize that this is beyond what I can do.
Raleigh, NC
Have you seen any evidence that young people think about leadership differently than adults?
Phill Wilson
The mistake adults make is adults often undervalue the things young people think are important. And they underestimate the importance of short-term successes.
With the young people we work with, and particularly with my two nephews who I live with, it is really important to set up an environment where they can find success in the short term, because that supports their commitment to continue at a task.
Abilene, TX
What has been most helpful for you in accomplishing the work you have done to date? And what has sustained you and your volunteer corps?
Phill Wilson
The important thing is that people really do want to change the world for the better. And if you believe in social justice, you have to believe that. So the most rewarding thing has been to see that manifest itself on this particular issue.
As we work with black people about HIV and AIDS, and black people are concerned about HIV and AIDS and they want to address the stigma and they want reduce new infections and they want to make sure that their loved ones have access to appropriate care.
So if you begin there, with the assumption that people are really looking for ways to make these changes, and then you see it happen, often in very little ways and every once in a while in a huge way.
For example, we work with the black media. We sent out invitations to the largest black media organizations in the country to attend a meeting. We sent out 20 invitations. We thought there was a possibility no one would respond. We were amazed that 19 of the 20 responded and attended the meeting.
When we explained to them how important the issue was and we presented them with something within their power that they could do, they responded.
Los Angeles
Can you give us some insight on the steps you have taken to ensure the future of your program/s and your evaluation procedures?
Phill Wilson
The first thing we are doing is dramatically expanding who the stakeholdes are in our organizations. One mistake new or emerging leaders can make is too much of the survival of their organization is dependent on them. We are certainly vulnerable in that area, but we are trying desperately to change that.
As you expand ownership of your organization or your work or your movement, you secure the future of your work or your organization or your movement, because you open the possibilities of finding success in places you never dreamed of and in places you could never visit.
Durham, NC
Can you share with us some statistics on the African American community and AIDS?
Phill Wilson
Here are a few quick stats that I'm able to share:
AIDS is the leading killer of Black men ages 18-44.
AIDS is the second leading killer of Black women in that same age range.
African Americans account for 13% of the US population and 57% of the 40,000 new cases of HIV reported in 1999-2000.
One in 160 Black women is HIV positive. One in 50 Black men is HIV positive.
Black senior citizens represent more than 50% of HIV cases among persons over the age of 55.
It is estimated that one third of those infected with HIV, in the United Stated, do not know they are infected.
Salt Lake City, Utah
No question yours is an uphill battle. What advice would you offer to leaders of different causes that also impact every community in the uphill battle of outreach and education to the public at large?
Phill Wilson
Persistence, persistence, persistence.
You can't give up and you can't expect change to happen in your timeline. You have to work with a sense of urgency and understanding that change needs to happen immediately, but a commitment to hang in there until it occurs, no matter how long that might be.
Leadership for a Changing World
That's all the time we have for today. Thank you for joining us for Leadership Talks.
For more information, you may contact Phill at:
Phill Wilson
Executive Director
African American AIDS Policy & Training Institute
1833 West 8th Street
Suite 200
Los Angeles, CA 90057
Phone: (213) 353-3610
Fax: (213) 989-0181
Email: phillw@aaainstitute.org
Web: www.aaainstitute.org
Stay tuned for future Leadership Talks.
Phill Wilson
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